Advice on FM2 hydra

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AgentLinkDark	Advice on FM2 hydra	Lead	[-]
Posts: 1 (08/31/09 21:54:15) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Tags : None hay guys, im looking for a bit of advice, i know alot of you guys are running boost (in paticular FM systems) and was hoping you guys could give me some advice. i just recently recieved my FM2 hydra system last week and its in the progress of being installed. i am undertaking this install myself and believe i am capable of it. i have spent the last 3 years researching engins, forced induction, ext. but research can only take you so far. so. now its time to get my hands dirty. any advice you guys could give me would be more than apreciated but my real concern is with the ECU. i hear alot of people saying that i require dyno tuneing or im going to hurt my engine. i am aware that FM includes a pre program in the ecu for "general" use but im also told that doesent matter synce there at about sea level and we're at 2100 feet, (so air is thiner i take it.) so anyway. wheres a good place to dyno it, or do i even need to. or perhaps can i steal or look at some of the maps any of you guys are using. oh yeh and the car is a 93, 1.6 and i went with the gt2554r (smaller) turbine. so any advice / personal experience would be more than welcome. thanks guys,
MX5 Miata Guy		#1	[-]
Posts: 3324 (09/01/09 04:06:58) Administrator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	There are two club members here who've done the Hydra...one installed by FM (as part of a larger project -- 2.0L stroker motor) and one installed by himself. I'll point the two of them to this thread...perhaps they'll comment. The self-installed one will have an article of said install in the Wild Rose Miata Club's next newsletter. Are you a WRMC member? If not, and you're in the Edmonton area, you may wish to consider becoming one. Have a look at our club website, specifically the Member Discounts page. Regards, Richard 2007 Stormy Blue Mica / saddle GT/PP/PRHT - 1 of 16 Special Order cars - 2006-12-23 to now 1990 Mariner Blue with double white stripes - 1993-07-24 to 2006-10-15 (sad to have let the old girl go)
AgentLinkDark		#2	[-]
Posts: 2 (09/01/09 09:54:31) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	i have conciderd for like 2 years now haha, i neve seem to get around to doing it. oh well i have the forms now so ill fill them out today then. and im jelous of the 2.0 stroker as thats my goal too. thanks again.,
MX5 Miata Guy		#3	[-]
Posts: 3326 (09/01/09 10:06:17) Administrator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Steven (IllDoItIfYouDoIt on the forum) is currently away, so may be a while before he posts -- though he had FM do the install and majority of the tuning. Alvin (Pwrdrftr on the forum) just did his Link to Hydra swap (having done a Link ECU years ago when he first turbo'd) and hopefully will get back to you here soon(er than Steven). Steven's car (was also a 1.6L) is profiled in the Projects in the Shop photos #832 to 838. Regards, Richard 2007 Stormy Blue Mica / saddle GT/PP/PRHT - 1 of 16 Special Order cars - 2006-12-23 to now 1990 Mariner Blue with double white stripes - 1993-07-24 to 2006-10-15 (sad to have let the old girl go)
AgentLinkDark		#4	[-]
Posts: 3 (09/01/09 22:50:38) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	cool, verry much arpreciate it.
IllDoItIfUDoIt		#5	[-]
Posts: 71 (09/02/09 20:42:46) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Hi AgentLinkDark: Welcome to the Miata turbo community. It's a dark path you've chosen - fun but the power bug will never stop bothering you. At least you've got a relatively easy upgrade path with your turbo kit (e.g. GT2560 turbo; water injection + more boost). I said easy, not cheap. To answer your main concern: The map that FM has supplied is designed to make safe power using 91 octane gas, so there is almost no chance of you damaging your engine using it. You can add a margin of extra safety by switching to 94 octane gas (I use Husky ethanol blend with very good results). In short, dyno tuning will help extract the last bit of power from your kit but won't make things safer for your engine. The fact that FM's tune was derived at about 5,000 feet (compared to Edmonton's 2,200) means that you will have to drive around in autotune mode for a while. It's easy to do and will improve drivability quite significantly. Don't worry too much about comparing maps with Alvin and me. We both have different turbos and engine displacements to each other and our maps will not be applicable to anyone else. If you send your map and some logs to Jeremy at FM, he can make some suggestions on how to bump up your power. The best option, as mentioned above, is to do this on a dyno, but it takes time ($$$) and no small level of expertise. I recommend scheduling a trip to FM's facility next year. It's a great drive too! Good luck. You're going to have fun. Oh, and join the club. Not only are we good people but the discounts we get make it extremely worthwhile. Steven
AgentLinkDark		#6	[-]
Posts: 4 (09/04/09 22:45:23) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	hay thanks, that definatly layed all my concerns to rest, ill let you know how it goes once the install is finished. hopefully tomorrow. thanks again.
Pwrdrftr	Re: Advice on FM2 hydra	#7	[-]
Posts: 390 (09/06/09 10:41:54) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Hi AgentLinkDark, The map FM sent with my ECU was surprisingly good for driving around & going into base boost. Enough that I can't really feel any improvement by the VE autotuning I've done. Not to say I've done that correctly though. One issue I found was the serial-to-USB cable supplied didn't work with my laptop. I had to purchase another one (Targus?) that worked straight-away. Another issue was the start settings were a bit lean, meaing a 2nd try on a cold engine was required. I've monkeyed around & think I have something that works. I can send that to you as a reference if you find you have cold-start issues. Per Steven's comments all our setups, engines etc are quite different so looking at our maps in general won't do you much good. Dyno tuning would be best & a trip to FM is always worthwhile (the roads closer-to especially). If you've gone through the Hydra manual you'll find it was written more as a book report than engine management setup. The tuning manual FM has is much more helpful & searching the internet will yield some insights. I'll echo that you really should joing the club. Just stay away from people with usernames like MX5 Miata Guy, IllDoItIfUDoIt & Pwrdrftr. They're more trouble than they're worth. regards, Alvin
AgentLinkDark		#8	[-]
Posts: 5 (09/10/09 17:30:42) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	sorry im not to familiar with terms so please bare with me, i was able to complete the install but i think i am having cold start issues ( if you mean that after the car has been sitting for a bit its hard to start) when it starts the 1st time it throws the rpm up to about 1500 then drops and stalls, second time it jumps but then stableizes at about 1200-1300 befor it reaches op temp and goes to about 950, the idle does seem to vibrate though, ecu sais 950-970 and the tach nedle vibrates, what can i do? thanks. and OMG i need a new clutch, by the way, does any one know where i can find the MSM 6 speed tansmition? i have a new clutch and flywheel from fm but would rather do them at the same time as the tranni swap.
AgentLinkDark		#9	[-]
Posts: 6 (09/10/09 17:32:05) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	oh yeh, and keep reminding my procrastinating ass to join the club, i keep passing the paperwork in the kitchen but go," ah ill do it later"
MX5 Miata Guy		#10	[-]
Posts: 3337 (09/11/09 05:53:02) Administrator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Cold start issues...phone Heremy at FM. 6-spd transmission...phone FM. BTW, installing a 6-spd isn't plug 'n play....there are some issues to work through. I think that there's an item on this in the Garage section at Miata.net. As to joining the WRMC...get off your duff! Regards, Richard 2007 Stormy Blue Mica / saddle GT/PP/PRHT - 1 of 16 Special Order cars - 2006-12-23 to now 1990 Mariner Blue with double white stripes - 1993-07-24 to 2006-10-15 (sad to have let the old girl go)
AgentLinkDark		#11	[-]
Posts: 7 (09/11/09 10:10:01) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	lol, FM doesent have the 6 speeds. checked, and from what i researched the msm6 are direct bolt on except for the starter i think, i wouldent be doing the trannie anyway. dont have the tools for it. but definatly ill call FM for the cold start, thanks.
AgentLinkDark		#12	[-]
Posts: 8 (09/12/09 12:33:07) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	ok, this is driving me nuts. how do i actualy use the auto tune function of the ecu? with learn data right? it keeps telling me that there is no learning function for this map or setting group.also after i upload amap to the ecu i seem to lose that function. the option is greyed out. and i have to reinstall the app, its rev8 also whenever i hit the trottle even jst a little the ecu sayes its at max, i notived when installing the harness that tere was a relay, every time i hit the throttle i hear it click. id phone fm and get this sorted but there notopen on weekends, anyhelp would be apreciated, thanks again.
Pwrdrftr	Re: Cold start & learn data	#13	[-]
Posts: 391 (09/13/09 14:22:19) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Hi AgentLinkDark, Good to hear you got the physical install out of the way. Your starting issue sounds like a cold start issue. If it catches, coughs, dies but catches the second time it's part of cold start issues. Go to Maps -> 2D Starting -> Post start enrichment decay[cycles/time@2000rpm]. If your default setting starts at 57.5-0s@2krpm & drops, you can increase the value a bit, keeping a nice curve until you hit the 40-48@2krpm value, which should remain at default. This will increase the amount of fuel the engine is fed when it is cold but has caught. Increase in increments so you don't go the other way (too rich). To use the learn data function you need to email FM (Jeremy) your laptop machine ID & get a code from him to enter into the Hydra software. Sorry, I don't remember exactly how to do this but Jeremy will. If your throttle position sensor (TPS) shows 100 at a slight touch you should re-do your throttle open/closed setup; you may have missed something there. regards, Alvin
AgentLinkDark		#14	[-]
Posts: 9 (09/14/09 23:29:51) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	ok thanks ill definatly mess with that a bit, i recalibrated a few times, same result, i guess ill have to talk to jeremy at fm then, on a side note, is dyno tuning it worth it?
AgentLinkDark		#15	[-]
Posts: 10 (09/14/09 23:31:17) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	oh yeh and i forgot to ask, maby you know, its tuff sometimes to get it beyond 5000rpm, its stuttering,. iv got a new fuel pump on the way, maby its that>?
IllDoItIfUDoIt		#16	[-]
Posts: 72 (10/01/09 11:16:02) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	I'm back in town and can join this thread again. To answer your first question: Dyno time will allow you to eke out the last bit of power potential of your set-up, but it's not going to show the difference you felt between stock and turbocharged. In my opinion, it's well worth it, but I'm a power junky. R.e. your miss: Several possibilities come to mind. Old spark plugs (replace with turbo-specific plugs from NGK. FM sells them but you can also get them locally). Tired coil pack. Tired plug wires (they tend to go bad every 50K or so on a Miata). Lean condition under full boost. If you haven't replaced the plugs, do so first. If your plug wires are old, get a new set from a dealer (NGK Blues), enjoying the 20%+ club discount (if you join). To test your air/fuel ratio, hook up your laptop and bring a friend. Have him check the A/F ration as you drive and make sure it stays around the 11:1 range (check with Jeremy for expected readings). If you're going lean (i.e. higher numbers like 14:1 or so), then you either have a tuning issue or a bad fuel pump. Stock fuel pumps are pretty hardy, so I don't think that's the problem. Let us know how you get on.

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